What Tutorials would help you to learn hexagon better?

[Tez]

Hello all.

If you could choose what tutorial your like to see what would it be, do you prefer writen or video based?

What about audio, would you rather have audio but a bigger file, or just visuals, smaller file. How about video streamed like Veoh video streaming?

Do you prefer project based tutorials where you actualy make somthink, or maybe direct learning of the functions with in depth usage of that tool?

What about timelaps tutorials, do you find these usfull having a explanation of whats happining, but not so detailed on how?

Would you be willing to pay for a more professional set of tutorials, with interactive menus for chapters. A tools section explaining what tools will be used and why.

In order to keep Hexagon alive, more tutorials need to be created, so if anyone has any thoughts on this, please reply. This means myself and others have a better idear on what you want to see.

Thanks.

[Grendel]

I'm not 100% convinced that tutorials will keep hexagon alive. I think enough already exist, though scattered to cover almsot everything. I think some sort of development news would help keep it alive.

[bwtr]

Have you done a Google search for "Hexagon Tutorials"?
Going through all those should keep someone busy for a (year) or so I think.

[Tez]

Yes Daz is a bit quiet but thats quite normal. I seem to see alot of requests for tutorials from new users. Maybe some of the current tutorials are not simple enougth, Im not realy sure.

I posted this thread to see just how many people actualy feel the need for more tutorials, only based what they realy needed and how others could maybe improove on them.

Its a real shame the way Hexagon is heading, id just like some people to see just how good this application is given a chance.

[laughingnome]

Originally Posted by Tez

Yes Daz is a bit quiet but thats quite normal. I seem to see alot of requests for tutorials from new users. Maybe some of the current tutorials are not simple enougth, Im not realy sure.

I posted this thread to see just how many people actualy feel the need for more tutorials, only based what they realy needed and how others could maybe improove on them.

Its a real shame the way Hexagon is heading, id just like some people to see just how good this application is given a chance.

Tez,
i agree with almost all of this.
Hexagon flawed as it is is still world class and will quite happily kick the crap out the big boys as a subd modelor for workflow and toolset in my opinion, as a nurbs modelor it sucks
modeling fundementals are the key to almost every app i think youll agree which is why we are changing the focus of this forumto technique aka when to use edge when to use box when to use nurbs,spline etc the list goes on i knowthese are the things poeple need to know
what app poeple use doesnt really matter

just my 2 cents

stu

[mayito7777]

I will say tutorials about UV mapping

[ButterflyFish]

Originally Posted by Tez

Maybe some of the current tutorials are not simple enougth, Im not realy sure.

Yes, that. And often they're not clear enough. Like the one in the tutorial manual that comes with the program, where it shows a round piece being extruded from an intersection. It doesn't do that when *I* try it. I get a mess.

Or they don't tell you where the tool is that you're supposed to use. When I was doing Steve's mushroom tutorial from PPros, I spent a good ten minutes looking for the dissolve command. It never occurred to me to look in the edit menu, and he didn't say where it was. I found it because I just started reading every single command in every single menu.

Beginners' tutorials need to assume that we don't know where anything is. Because we usually don't.

I paid for Hexagon (granted, not much, but still). I like the interface. I want to like the program, and I want to use it, but I'm banging my head against the wall trying to learn the thing. Yes, there are a lot of tutorials, but there are not so many that are beginnery enough.

I would love to see Here is How You Make a Shirt. A simple shirt. Not Xena Warrior Princess-wear. Just something with a torso and some sleeves. I've tried about seven different versions of shirt-making tutorials designed for various programs, but I have yet to find one that comes out the way the tutorial expects it to. I managed to model the one in the DAZ tutorial Arcana, but when I went to map it there were mesh weirdnesses all over the place. And obviously if I knew how to fix that, I wouldn't need the tutorial in the first place. Plus it didn't have sleeves, IIRC.

And yes, I'm going to bug you all over the place, Tez.

[Talonn]

"Beginners' tutorials need to assume that we don't know where anything is. Because we usually don't. "

Absolutely. Let's have a rank beginners tutorial. This I would LOVE to see! I am just getting started and am very confused. I am a smart person, but to begin something like this, one must have a teaching method that speaks to us beginniers.

Video is nice, but written is very good if it is done well. Interactive is excellent.

I would pay for an EXCELLENT beginner tutorial.

[Pete Exxtreme]

maybe this would help :
http://www.3dtutorials.sk/index.php?id=161&page=

[Tez]

Good to see some feedback. I have started, and am in fact half way through a beginners tutorial but from what iv read, this maybe behond beginer.

This the first time iv ever done a writen tutorial and to be honnest its very, very time consuming, here is why. If the tutorial is for a beginer then a writen tutorial is limited to very simplistic items made, purly because it would be like writing a manual for the program. To asume that the beginner knows absolutly nothink would mean a explanation for every tool used and a explanation of the entire interface with hundreds of screen shots. In the time it took to write, about 6 videos could be made as the tutor would only have to explain things once, with a visual explanation.

I personly think for total beginers video is the way to go, as they can watch it and listen to it again and again. To exlpain every single thing that you would see in detail into pure text, would take alot of pages of writing, grammer checking, takeing no asumption that the one learning knows termanology used.

The writen camera tutorial is a good exsample. It explains things righ to the point and gets the job done athough I havent done it, iv seen it and think its nicly done. If what im reading that beginers want even more in depth to the explanation that the camera tutorial then video is for sure the way to go.

Know I can make interactive videos, meaning they have sellectable chapters, auto pause forkey areas while you go to do whats be shown this in Hexagon, one click continues the tutorial. This takes longer but by no way as long as writen.

Maybe you would like to see a quick exsample?

[Tez]

Thanks for that link Pete, looks ideal.

[Talonn]

That makes excellent sense, the video method. I look forward to seeing it!

I am thinking that a text of the video should be made, I have software to do that, and then someone like me can help in making the more in depth manual type text.

And yes, I would love to see an example.

[Tez]

Ok guys, click on the link and wait while it loads. I made this so it dont auto start. press play on the player controls and interact when asked.

http://www.screencast.com/t/Z0MZ3xdUkc

(Note) you may have the refresh the web page to get it to start, thats what I had to do.

[mayito7777]

It worked fine for me without need for refreshing.

[Talonn]

No need to refresh for me either.

This is GREAT my friend! The videos are what I am needing, and what so many of us clamor for. THANK you!

[laughingnome]

refresh here no biggie

coupla points Tez, i hope you dont mind
you may want to enable the command viewer in hex for video tuts, its found in the prefs.
it allows poeple to see your last command.

your tutorial is based on the default 4 view option however it doesnt mention that you can change any of the views by clicking in them and using the numpad shortcuts to customise the veiws.
it doesnt cover single viewport or immersive workspace options (my preffered workspace)

these are NOT critisms, just observations and some things you may want to add to the tutorial.

keep em coming

stu

[JohnnyRoy]

Hi Tez,

I just purchased Hexagon 2.2 a few days ago and when I Googled for tutorials, this site was the first hit. I saw your post and couldn't resist replying.

I have gone through the written tutorials that come with Hexagon and they are not very well written. They assume you already know how to use the program. What good is that for someone who just purchased your product? I spent more time searching for the functions than actually modeling. All they had to do was use the icon in the text or simply say "use the Bend tool on the Utilities tab" and it would have been so much easier to follow. Instead I spent hours highlighting each icon on every tool bar to see which one said Bend.

So while I am not a beginner in 3D (I've used Cinema 4D, Carrara, Vue, etc.), as a new user of Hexagon I feel somewhat qualified to tell you what this new user needs.

Originally Posted by Tez

If you could choose what tutorial your like to see what would it be, do you prefer writen or video based?

Some people like to read but I prefer video especially for beginners because it is impossible to explain "actions". Showing someone how to create a selection in a video is far easier than trying to write about and and interpret what is written.

Originally Posted by Tez

What about audio, would you rather have audio but a bigger file, or just visuals, smaller file. How about video streamed like Veoh video streaming?

For me audio is mandatory. I was lost on the ([Hex 1.2] Video: modelling a water mineral bottle) tutorial because it was silent. I was completely lost. You need audio but MORE IMPORTANTLY you need to explain not only WHAT you are doing by WHY you are doing it. This is the only way for the student to internalize what is being done and make it their own. Silent tutorials can never explain why and so I don't understand them. I need to know why if I am going to learn when to use a particular tool.

Originally Posted by Tez

Do you prefer project based tutorials where you actualy make somthink, or maybe direct learning of the functions with in depth usage of that tool?

Project based tutorials teach far more about how to model than just talking about unrelated functions. The user's manual has all the functions. Tell people to read it as a prereq. Tutorials should explain why you care about a function by presenting a problem (i.e., what you are about to model) and then solving it using specific functions. Students can then relate those functions to similar problems that they are trying to solve.

For example: I bought a new camera that had two buttons that could memorize the camera settings so that you could quickly switch between them. I read the manual and said, "oh that's nice, I'll probbaly never use these". Then I bought a training video on the camera and the instructor said, "have you ever wondered how to make a perfect rack focus?". Well... now he had my attention. A perfect Rack Focus is hard to do because it's easy to overshoot the focus. He explained that you could focus on the first subject and have one button remember the settings. Then focus on the next subject and store those settings in the second button. Now just cycle between the two buttons to push the focus back and forth with perfect precision! These are now my two favorite buttons on the camera!!! Why? Because the instructor explained WHY I would want to use them not just HOW to use them like the manual did. This is what you need to aim for.

Originally Posted by Tez

What about timelaps tutorials, do you find these usfull having a explanation of whats happining, but not so detailed on how?

Perhaps for advanced users but not for beginners. Assume nothing when writing a beginners tutorial. If you want to attract new users, don't leave anything out.

Originally Posted by Tez

Would you be willing to pay for a more professional set of tutorials, with interactive menus for chapters. A tools section explaining what tools will be used and why.

YES! Actually, I write books and do video training for a living. I expect people to pay for my training books and DVD's so I have no problem paying for yours. Quality professional training from a good teacher is worth paying for.

The problem is that everyone who knows how to model is not necessarily a good teacher as well. You need to "teach", not just "show". You need to explain why not just how. You need to target a particular skill level and teach at that level. There's nothing wrong with having beginner, intermediate, and advanced training. As long as your assumptions match the skill level you have targeted. You need to beta test your training to make sure it meets these objectives if you expect people to pay for it.

Originally Posted by Tez

In order to keep Hexagon alive, more tutorials need to be created, so if anyone has any thoughts on this, please reply. This means myself and others have a better idear on what you want to see.

Perhaps not just more tutorials but higher quality tutorials. I want to see training on what attracted me to buy Hexagon in the first place. I saw the demo at the DAZ site with the prehistoric creature being built and when I saw 3D painting of textures right on the model I took out my credit card and bought Hexagon right there on the spot. I have yet to figure out how to paint 3D textures and I feel cheated. I'm now reading the User's manual trying to figure it out but instead of being task based, it keeps telling me to read about UV's first and then textures and then... Ahh! Just show me already!!!

So I'm a big believer in task based training. i.e., don't teach me everything I could ever want to know about UV maps... just teach me what i need to know about UV's to complete the task at hand (e.g., painting textures). Students are more likely to remember this way because what they are learning is relevant to what they actually want to know.

Hope this helps.

~jr

[Tez]

Originally Posted by laughingnome

refresh here no biggie

coupla points Tez, i hope you dont mind
you may want to enable the command viewer in hex for video tuts, its found in the prefs.
it allows poeple to see your last command.

your tutorial is based on the default 4 view option however it doesnt mention that you can change any of the views by clicking in them and using the numpad shortcuts to customise the veiws.
it doesnt cover single viewport or immersive workspace options (my preffered workspace)

these are NOT critisms, just observations and some things you may want to add to the tutorial.

keep em coming

stu

Hey, thanks for your input, im always up for a good crit, thats how I learn.. However in this case, it is not a tutorial for Hexagon, it was to demo how interactive Camtasia is, I just used hex to show this.

I didnt know about the command viewer in Hexagon, Il use that next time I do a tutorial.

Ohh one more thing, I must comment on your drawings, I think they are great, this is where my art started from, good to see some pencil on paper.

Thanks.

[Tez]

JohnnyRoy, thanks for your detailed input, very helpfull.

The concern at the moment is Daz3d. I have my doubts about Hexagon being in the right hands, due to the way they deal with their other products. For one thing, each patch seems to bring as many problems as they have fixed, or at least it would seem so.

Seing how they have given a half writen manual for Carrara 6, shows bad business and customer care. The only infomation they give out is a regular promotion of their content.

Iv used a good few 3D applications, and Hexagon has somthink very special going for it, with the correct training every new user will see how fast this application is.

[dlk30341]

Several things....as with Butterflyfish - I'm having trouble deciding what shape I should begin with.

I'd like to see tutorials on how to do a house(interior as well), a sea shell(conch style)in addition when you are modeling a tree & you want to use alpha planes for leaves how do you place them on the tree in Hex to get good coverage?

Also how to get better control over the tools in general. For example when using the sweep tool any slight movement of my mouse gets me some hideous shape that ends up covering my whole workspace LOL. I have to slowly inch my way back to some normalcy.

More basic how to's

Also, I prefer mine in printable format, having to toggle back n forth between video & workspace I find myself loosing interest.

Ditto JohnnyRoy as well.

Thanks