Modo Siggraph 2008 - Polyloop

jbshorty · 12th August 2008, 17:32

Hi all. Some people who attended the Modo event at Siggraph are confirming that Luxology previewed hair/fur/grass, and volumetric lighting. Also Lux was demoing a render scene with at least 12 billion polygons

!!! Hopefully this high-poly handling will benefit sculpting and real-time viewports as well...

It's not everything I hoped to see, but all were on my list. So i am pleased with this news so far. Hopefully more things to be announced later this week... I'm hoping for more rendering improvements such as blurry refractions, photon mapping, chromatic dispersion, more procedural shaders, NPR shaders, and hopefully a full SDK.

It's also interesting that Solidworks was a sponsor of the modo event. The only thing i can imagine is that they've been working to expose modo as an external render engine. I would love to use Modo as external render engine for other applications such as Rhino. My fingers are crossed!!!

jonah

Thomas · 12th August 2008, 17:45

Rendering 12 billions of polygons is not the same than displaying 12 billions of polygons

XSI can already do that with Gigacore

On my side, I'm waiting more bones for easy pose (and not the kind of topology selection) and more FX stuff (lights, particles, etc.)

jbshorty · 12th August 2008, 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas

Rendering 12 billions of polygons is not the same than displaying 12 billions of polygons

I am allowed to dream, right?

Anyway, it's possible they made optimizations to the poly handling of the viewports as Luxology is really pushing into ArchViz and CAD territory now... BTW, I just got my dual-quad system from Boxx this past weekend. And i can easily mesh-sculpt with 1.5M polys (6M OGL polys) in modo with very little delay. It's enough for me at the moment...

jonah

jbshorty · 12th August 2008, 18:23

there are reports coming in that modo was rendering over 1.1 TRILLION polygons

I hope that really is true... Also check out this report someone just posted on Lux forums:

"Real time full resolution updating within a second or two in a very large preview window ( at least 1024x720 and the scale drop down had larger settings). All lights, textures, motion, backgrounds, effects updating realtime. Brad was doing texture and lighting changes by drag and dropping presets off a large multitab preset picker at bottom of screen and dropping them on parts of nodel or just clicking as in light setups.

Volumetrics the Modo way: in other words not just volumetric lighting but all tools and materials etc. active in new tool. Drop a procedural onto a volumetric light, use the scultping tools etc.

The clone tool from Hell - CTFH ( well Brad had a cooler name ) Thats what is doing the image at the top of this thread. Kind of a uber instance array/scatter tool that follow a surface or array with a ton of the usual fits in with all the other tools settings that come back to the Nexus thing again. Works within/along with the other tools.

Not a hair system - a Fur material. It just doesnt do hair it is a new material setting that does any highly detailed "fur" like objects' set it to hair, set it to shag carpet, set it to grass ( combine this with the CTFH and do a 1 to 1 scale model of Nebraska in real time ) again with all the tools - Fluffy the cat does look fluffy enough - whip out the sculpt tools and drag him out to persian kitty fur lengths - use a gradiant to tie-die his inner hippy Kitty. Use it for towels Use it for fungus

Clear Coat material settings Dont work the materials pipeline to get the color jus right then mess it up trying to get the reflections to work in same layer as the colors - just drop that clear coat on and Bingo.

Technology licensing and tech devolpment from nexus to and from with Solid Works and Bentley. Big deal you say? Think again. Example: If they work on getting Modo/solid works engine scaled up to do real time full color , down to the millimeter CAD acurate previews and renders and motion guess who gets to use it in the little old modeller program? Think of the Materials piplines they could come up with.

And while 401 was seen on a computer or to ( yes once in a error report ) They didnt announce it so me thinks this aint near the full feature list

No announcements on CA -

jbshorty · 12th August 2008, 21:47

I just finished watching all the preview videos and there's some good stuff. Better topology tools, drag and drop render browser, improved real-time render preview. The "fur" shader looks interesting too. Sort of like Anything Grows on steroids. Looks like I'll be upgrading when 401 arrives... also it's been confirmed that Dassault has a modified version of the Modo render engine inside of Solidworks! What's up with that? Can i get one for Rhino, pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease???!!!

jonah

-ash- · 12th August 2008, 22:10

Just finished watching the technology previews too. Looks like good stuff and builds nicely on the exisiting toolset.

I notice a lot of talk about CA tools not being shown but for me looks good. I mean I've hardly touched the surface of modo as it is (still working through oodles of tutorials)

Anyway, looks like I'l be upgrading to the next version when it comes around

jbshorty · 12th August 2008, 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by -ash-

Just finished watching the technology previews too. Looks like good stuff and builds nicely on the exisiting toolset.

I notice a lot of talk about CA tools not being shown but for me looks good. I mean I've hardly touched the surface of modo as it is (still working through oodles of tutorials)

Anyway, looks like I'l be upgrading to the next version when it comes around

CA is not so important to me yet, either. I'm happy this next release will focus on render goodies...

-ash- · 12th August 2008, 22:25

Yep, render goodies are goodie

More procedural shader stuff would be cool too. I spent many happy hours with Cararra shaders. modo seems a little limited in comparison - but perhaps I just don't know enough yet.

jbshorty · 12th August 2008, 22:33

No, your observation is correct. Modo's procedural shaders need a serious kick in the ass. Look at what Julian, Eric, and Mark were able to do on their spare time for Carrara. Luxology should take note. Modo can't even make a procedural brick pattern at this point. this fact is exactly why I hold SDK near the top of my feature requests...

jonah

-ash- · 12th August 2008, 23:32

I'm glad to see it wasn't just me

Looks like I was spoiled by Eric's plugins and the Cararra shader tree. I wonder If Eric would take on creating modo shader plugins if the SDK was open enough?

jbshorty · 13th August 2008, 00:14

Yeah, those Carrara plugins are great. I once discussed it with Eric, but he wasn't too interested at the time. I think we should all start a petition…

Actually there are rumors that Imagesynth 2 will be released soon. It's built by Allegorithmic (the same people who make MapZone). I would not be surprised at all if IS2 has some of this functionality and can plug in directly to Modo's shader stack. I'm guessing of course! Wishful thinking...

jonah

Wася · 13th August 2008, 17:04

Did I miss 1 of April?

jbshorty · 13th August 2008, 20:00

???

Wася · 13th August 2008, 20:06

Sorry, my bad.
The date of the first post is 12 August, not 1st April.

The most funny joke was about 1.1T polys.

jbshorty · 13th August 2008, 21:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wася

...The most funny joke was about 1.1T polys...

I know it seems like a joke, as Modo was notorious for bad handling of high-poly scenes. But it's true! It was confirmed by Bob of Luxology that they rendered 1.1T polygons with GI in less than 6 minutes an a dual-quad.

jonah

Wася · 13th August 2008, 22:16

I believe you, shorty.
But every time like that I'm thinking they are using some other quads. Miraculous ones. Beyond the reach of mere mortals.

Locki · 14th August 2008, 08:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbshorty

... Modo can't even make a procedural brick pattern at this point. this fact is exactly why I hold SDK near the top of my feature requests...

jonah

Euuuh ! JB could you explain ? I thought there was already a SDK for Modo ... moreover there are 2 famous languages interpreters connected deep inside Modo engine : Perl and Python, the first one being well know from the Sysadmins and Unices fans, and the last one being more and more popular inside 3D softwares (and among unices communities as well).

Wася · 14th August 2008, 09:42

This SDK is for import/export only. Using this SDK it's not possible to make plug-ins, add 3rd party renderers into the environment et al.

Locki · 14th August 2008, 14:41

I better understand what you mean, now

Thx

jbshorty · 14th August 2008, 17:23

I think they first put out the I/O SDK to help push into archviz & product sector with the Sketchup and Rhino translators. But making a full SDK means they have to "lock down" the program. And i suppose we'll not see a real SDK for a while, as Modo seems to be very far from the mature app which Luxology wants it to become... Too bad though, i am sure a lot of 3rd party programmers are eager to exploit this new market...

jonah

12th August 2008, 17:32	#1 (permalink)
jbshorty proud to be a nurb Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: only in your mind Posts: 1,362	Modo Siggraph 2008 Hi all. Some people who attended the Modo event at Siggraph are confirming that Luxology previewed hair/fur/grass, and volumetric lighting. Also Lux was demoing a render scene with at least 12 billion polygons !!! Hopefully this high-poly handling will benefit sculpting and real-time viewports as well... It's not everything I hoped to see, but all were on my list. So i am pleased with this news so far. Hopefully more things to be announced later this week... I'm hoping for more rendering improvements such as blurry refractions, photon mapping, chromatic dispersion, more procedural shaders, NPR shaders, and hopefully a full SDK. It's also interesting that Solidworks was a sponsor of the modo event. The only thing i can imagine is that they've been working to expose modo as an external render engine. I would love to use Modo as external render engine for other applications such as Rhino. My fingers are crossed!!! jonah

12th August 2008, 17:45	#2 (permalink)
Thomas Always learning new stuff Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Merignac, France Posts: 11,295	Rendering 12 billions of polygons is not the same than displaying 12 billions of polygons XSI can already do that with Gigacore On my side, I'm waiting more bones for easy pose (and not the kind of topology selection) and more FX stuff (lights, particles, etc.) __________________ Polyloop owner & Administrator - no support by PM or email. Polyloop [EN/FR] - Meuuh [FR +16 ans] - Totyo [FR] - Pixologic [JOB] - Le ZBlog [JOB] - La3dpourlesnuls [FR]

12th August 2008, 22:10	#6 (permalink)
-ash- I'm Batman (in 3D) Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Over the road, round the corner, out of the noise. (Scotland) Posts: 765	Just finished watching the technology previews too. Looks like good stuff and builds nicely on the exisiting toolset. I notice a lot of talk about CA tools not being shown but for me looks good. I mean I've hardly touched the surface of modo as it is (still working through oodles of tutorials) Anyway, looks like I'l be upgrading to the next version when it comes around __________________ Regards Tony (aka HamSoles)

12th August 2008, 22:25	#8 (permalink)
-ash- I'm Batman (in 3D) Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Over the road, round the corner, out of the noise. (Scotland) Posts: 765	Yep, render goodies are goodie More procedural shader stuff would be cool too. I spent many happy hours with Cararra shaders. modo seems a little limited in comparison - but perhaps I just don't know enough yet. __________________ Regards Tony (aka HamSoles)

12th August 2008, 23:32	#10 (permalink)
-ash- I'm Batman (in 3D) Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Over the road, round the corner, out of the noise. (Scotland) Posts: 765	I'm glad to see it wasn't just me Looks like I was spoiled by Eric's plugins and the Cararra shader tree. I wonder If Eric would take on creating modo shader plugins if the SDK was open enough? __________________ Regards Tony (aka HamSoles)

12th August 2008, 18:23	#4 (permalink)
jbshorty proud to be a nurb Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: only in your mind Posts: 1,362	there are reports coming in that modo was rendering over 1.1 TRILLION polygons I hope that really is true... Also check out this report someone just posted on Lux forums: "Real time full resolution updating within a second or two in a very large preview window ( at least 1024x720 and the scale drop down had larger settings). All lights, textures, motion, backgrounds, effects updating realtime. Brad was doing texture and lighting changes by drag and dropping presets off a large multitab preset picker at bottom of screen and dropping them on parts of nodel or just clicking as in light setups. Volumetrics the Modo way: in other words not just volumetric lighting but all tools and materials etc. active in new tool. Drop a procedural onto a volumetric light, use the scultping tools etc. The clone tool from Hell - CTFH ( well Brad had a cooler name ) Thats what is doing the image at the top of this thread. Kind of a uber instance array/scatter tool that follow a surface or array with a ton of the usual fits in with all the other tools settings that come back to the Nexus thing again. Works within/along with the other tools. Not a hair system - a Fur material. It just doesnt do hair it is a new material setting that does any highly detailed "fur" like objects' set it to hair, set it to shag carpet, set it to grass ( combine this with the CTFH and do a 1 to 1 scale model of Nebraska in real time ) again with all the tools - Fluffy the cat does look fluffy enough - whip out the sculpt tools and drag him out to persian kitty fur lengths - use a gradiant to tie-die his inner hippy Kitty. Use it for towels Use it for fungus Clear Coat material settings Dont work the materials pipeline to get the color jus right then mess it up trying to get the reflections to work in same layer as the colors - just drop that clear coat on and Bingo. Technology licensing and tech devolpment from nexus to and from with Solid Works and Bentley. Big deal you say? Think again. Example: If they work on getting Modo/solid works engine scaled up to do real time full color , down to the millimeter CAD acurate previews and renders and motion guess who gets to use it in the little old modeller program? Think of the Materials piplines they could come up with. And while 401 was seen on a computer or to ( yes once in a error report ) They didnt announce it so me thinks this aint near the full feature list No announcements on CA -

12th August 2008, 21:47	#5 (permalink)
jbshorty proud to be a nurb Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: only in your mind Posts: 1,362	I just finished watching all the preview videos and there's some good stuff. Better topology tools, drag and drop render browser, improved real-time render preview. The "fur" shader looks interesting too. Sort of like Anything Grows on steroids. Looks like I'll be upgrading when 401 arrives... also it's been confirmed that Dassault has a modified version of the Modo render engine inside of Solidworks! What's up with that? Can i get one for Rhino, pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease???!!! jonah

12th August 2008, 22:33	#9 (permalink)
jbshorty proud to be a nurb Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: only in your mind Posts: 1,362	No, your observation is correct. Modo's procedural shaders need a serious kick in the ass. Look at what Julian, Eric, and Mark were able to do on their spare time for Carrara. Luxology should take note. Modo can't even make a procedural brick pattern at this point. this fact is exactly why I hold SDK near the top of my feature requests... jonah

13th August 2008, 00:14	#11 (permalink)
jbshorty proud to be a nurb Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: only in your mind Posts: 1,362	Yeah, those Carrara plugins are great. I once discussed it with Eric, but he wasn't too interested at the time. I think we should all start a petition… Actually there are rumors that Imagesynth 2 will be released soon. It's built by Allegorithmic (the same people who make MapZone). I would not be surprised at all if IS2 has some of this functionality and can plug in directly to Modo's shader stack. I'm guessing of course! Wishful thinking... jonah

13th August 2008, 17:04	#12 (permalink)
Wася Misinterpreted signal Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Moscow, Russia Posts: 394	Did I miss 1 of April? __________________ (Vista 64-bit, Intel Q6700, 8GB, GeForce 8800GTS)

13th August 2008, 20:00	#13 (permalink)
jbshorty proud to be a nurb Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: only in your mind Posts: 1,362	???

13th August 2008, 20:06	#14 (permalink)
Wася Misinterpreted signal Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Moscow, Russia Posts: 394	Sorry, my bad. The date of the first post is 12 August, not 1st April. The most funny joke was about 1.1T polys. __________________ (Vista 64-bit, Intel Q6700, 8GB, GeForce 8800GTS)

13th August 2008, 22:16	#16 (permalink)
Wася Misinterpreted signal Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Moscow, Russia Posts: 394	I believe you, shorty. But every time like that I'm thinking they are using some other quads. Miraculous ones. Beyond the reach of mere mortals. __________________ (Vista 64-bit, Intel Q6700, 8GB, GeForce 8800GTS)

14th August 2008, 09:42	#18 (permalink)
Wася Misinterpreted signal Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Moscow, Russia Posts: 394	This SDK is for import/export only. Using this SDK it's not possible to make plug-ins, add 3rd party renderers into the environment et al. __________________ (Vista 64-bit, Intel Q6700, 8GB, GeForce 8800GTS) Last edited by Wася; 14th August 2008 at 16:05.

14th August 2008, 14:41	#19 (permalink)
Locki 3D zingué Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: 3ème planète après Sol, au fond du couloir, à droite Posts: 2,132	I better understand what you mean, now Thx __________________ cherche le Nord depuis de nombreuses années. Pour le moment je suis encore à l'Ouest.

14th August 2008, 17:23	#20 (permalink)
jbshorty proud to be a nurb Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: only in your mind Posts: 1,362	I think they first put out the I/O SDK to help push into archviz & product sector with the Sketchup and Rhino translators. But making a full SDK means they have to "lock down" the program. And i suppose we'll not see a real SDK for a while, as Modo seems to be very far from the mature app which Luxology wants it to become... Too bad though, i am sure a lot of 3rd party programmers are eager to exploit this new market... jonah

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