3D and Art - Page 2 - Polyloop

Sketchy · 5th May 2007, 03:17

Picasso's art is crap to me, but it is worth millions of dollars to others. There are people who can never draw/paint human heads, but are excellent in producing still-lifes or landscapes. They are still called artists. So what is art? Art, to me, is an individual thing. It's mainly to please oneself. It is art because you enjoyed doing it. The hell with the opinions of others.

Fast forward we now have what we call WIPs or interactive critiques. Others' opinions are more important than ours. The individuality is lost. People are so obsessed into ultra realism. They talk about global illumination, ambient occlusion, radiosity, etc. You go to Blender's forum people are making a big deal out of this new SSS shading feature thinking that such feature will finally make their human model as realistic as humanly possible. It's as if humans actually look like candles. This has got to stop.

This, I think, is what makes 3D users restless. They can't stick with one app.

bwtr · 5th May 2007, 03:31

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder--and it's something that is "learned" by lifes experiences.

ART is NOTHING to do with beauty. For those who study art and art history, the art in art is taking the learning of the past and adding to it.

So saying a particular style of art is ,say. rubbish, is really a lack of understanding about the works creation, in time and place.

Time and place.

That is where, maybe, some 3D artists will, in retrospect, be added to a Hall Of Fame. There special works which greatly added to the contemporary sum of knowledge.

Some of us are painters, some of us are craftsmen. Who of us will be amongst the few to be acknowledged as true "Artists"?

Sketchy · 5th May 2007, 03:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwtr

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder--and it's something that is "learned" by lifes experiences.

ART is NOTHING to do with beauty. For those who study art and art history, the art in art is taking the learning of the past and adding to it.

So saying a particular style of art is ,say. rubbish, is really a lack of understanding about the works creation, in time and place.

You then just contradicted yourself by saying it is a lack of understanding. Why? You just said "beauty is in the eye of the beholder."

Couerl · 5th May 2007, 03:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Exxtreme

If so, what about Conceptual, or PostModern Art ?

Mark Rothko well known paints are just "raw" colors somehow, but isn't it art ?

Well, it's probably crap for a lot of people who would prefered a picture of Britney S. with her autograph

Yes, all good points. Speaking of Brittany, remember last year the sculpture of her pregnant on a bearskin rug giving birth, the guy is at it again this time with Paris Hilton, dead on an autopsy table from driving drunk. She's an "interactive" art piece, clutching her cellphone with her tacobell dog hovering over her. This to me is not art and just an exploitation of the media.

http://www.nypress.com/blogx/display...startyear=2007

Couerl · 5th May 2007, 03:51

Sketchy I agree with you that a lot of people are telling themselves, "If I only had this one more tool, I'll be good"... SSS and all that does not a better artist make, but rather they just add to what an artist can accomplish. I don't think I'll be one of those household names in 20 years by the way, I do 3D because I just like the idea of making things in 3 dimensions and actually like the modeling part more than anything else.
I do welcome new tools anyway and I love to see what people do with them.

Nate Owens · 5th May 2007, 04:40

Hmmm... don't think I ever did any black-light felt posters...

and I don't think those figurines are plaster, but what do I know...?

I just work for a living like all the other millions of writhing humanities... I'm sort of glad to be able to do something I like... I could be a pea-picker or a chicken plucker - and it's for sure that none of my anatomical parts are worth as much as Van's ear or wibble's dingus

.

I suspect it ("art") may fall into two camps... both of which are like the wind which can blow one direction and then the other. The times change but the mechanics are the same.

1: The art can appeal to the current "heartstrings" of the masses (at one time that may have been the Norman Rockwell fantasy of idyllic American Pie) which also changes like the wind.

Or...

2: The art can be declared wonderful by those who, for a fleeting moment, have the ear and admiration of the people - yesteryear it was the pope who said Michelangelo could paint and then made him paint his ceiling - Mike hated it I think - ... or in more recent times, movie stars and authors of the moment who declared that Andy Warhol's tomato soup cans were awesome masterpieces.

It may be sad but true that the mainstream doesn't have a clue (or a care) what art is, unless someone "important" tells them what to like. - - - sort of like that tale about the emperor's new clothes...

My personal admiration and awe is for any (human) who can do what Michelangelo did with one piece of solid rock... totally mind-boggling - regardless of how many years it took. (sorry, cg artists)

bwtr · 5th May 2007, 04:50

Sketchy! That is what I was saying. Art and beauty, in themselves, have no reason to connect.

I can love a piece of work for it's Art, but hate it for it's "beauty"!

It's a concept that is very hard to grasp at first but, when you can become an, well, "appreciator", it really does broaden the experiences of "visual gratifications" I suggest.

A camera, a pencil, a brush,watercolour, oils,-------3D programmes-----all are only tools that are only a means to an end --not the end! We tend to carry on about the how when the really only important thing is the end result.

As has been said in earlier threads, no one(other than our fellow crafstmen) really cares about the hard work and effort put into the end work. But the community will still give works one, two, three "star" ratings anyway! It was the story line!!!!!!

Sketchy · 5th May 2007, 05:08

I'm not actually contradicting anybody here especially when I say "art is an individual thing." I call it art because you enjoyed doing it. For in the final analysis we can never please everybody. When I say that Picasso's art is crap doesn't mean it is not art. Perhaps I could have been more politically correct by saying I just don't appreciate it.

Talk about time and place, Van Gogh's artworks were not appreciated during his time. His originals are now worth millions of dollars.

(We should all pat ourselves in the back because we have a passion for this thing called 3d. We are among the luckiest people on earth. Most people can't stay at home for long. They feel restless. One friend gambled his way to bankruptcy. Another spends hundreds of dollars going out every weekend and goes home drunk.)

bwtr · 5th May 2007, 05:55

Sketch, you said "I call it art because you enjoyed doing it"

YES YES YES!

But, would you, if you were not trying to better your effort with-- "the next one"?

Who cares, really, if your work is not appreciated? All the fun is in the learning--the challenge--TO ONES SELF!

Couerl · 5th May 2007, 07:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate Owens

I could be a pea-picker or a chicken plucker - and it's for sure that none of my anatomical parts are worth as much as Van's ear or wibble's dingus

Hehe:
"If I didn't start painting, I would have raised chickens". Grandma Moses

95 year old painter lady, good catch!

http://thinkexist.com/quotes/grandma_moses/

bwtr · 5th May 2007, 07:14

Painting/Art?/3D--------SEX!

Why do YOU do it?

Sketchy · 5th May 2007, 16:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Couerl

Sketchy I agree with you that a lot of people are telling themselves, "If I only had this one more tool, I'll be good"... SSS and all that does not a better artist make, but rather they just add to what an artist can accomplish. I don't think I'll be one of those household names in 20 years by the way, I do 3D because I just like the idea of making things in 3 dimensions and actually like the modeling part more than anything else.
I do welcome new tools anyway and I love to see what people do with them.

Well, I'm just as guilty as a lot of people. I still find myself struggling whether to buy this other 3d app or that one, then revert to why can't I just stick with what I have? I have Vue4, TrueSpace 6, Shade, Amapi Pro, Carrara 5 and Hexagon. Of all, I'm most comfortable with Carrara 5 and Hexagon. There's absolutely no doubt that you can model anything you can imagine with Hexagon. The only reason why I use Blender's modeler is because I still have an old PC and this openGL lighting I can't control in Hexagon.

About Carrara, well, I thought long and hard about it, opened it for the first time in weeks and see what it can do even just on surface. Man, this is more than enough for my needs.

I revisited these images that comes right out of Carrara 5's box. You can see them in the Scene Wizard. Each took about less than 1 minute to render. I don't know who made them.

crazy wabbit · 5th May 2007, 18:29

Call me crazy, but I truly believe that carrara does and can do most beautiful scenes. The ease of use and image quality are top notch. Carrara 6 and beyond will be even more amazing.

Nate Owens · 5th May 2007, 21:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwtr

Painting/Art?/3D--------SEX!

Why do YOU do it?

Art?.... Because I have to...

nothing to do with money, I'd do it if I never got paid to and I'd do it if I was on a deserted island and all I had was sand and a stick. I've never been addicted to drugs, but art for me is one addiction that I love.

bwtr · 6th May 2007, 02:55

I think most who are really into artistic pursuits occasionally have those episodes where the art takes hold of your mind and body and you get the fealing of being a second person, standing behind yourself, watching your hand being creative without your instruction.

When you are finished, you look at the end result in amazement and wonder where that idea and effort originated.

I know this is not an uncommon thing for artists--really a WOW!

crazy wabbit · 6th May 2007, 04:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwtr

I think most who are really into artistic pursuits occasionally have those episodes where the art takes hold of your mind and body and you get the fealing of being a second person, standing behind yourself, watching your hand being creative without your instruction.

When you are finished, you look at the end result in amazement and wonder where that idea and effort originated.

I know this is not an uncommon thing for artists--really a WOW!

Did you have too much carrot juice?

Nate Owens · 6th May 2007, 05:53

Don't think I've had any of those episodes.
Sounds like what mediums and spiritualists refer to as "spirit writing."

There are times when I make an accidental "edit" to the art that I decide I like more than what I really intended.

I have been known to compulsively doodle on napkins and paper placemats in restaurants... never had any complaints about doing it though.

I think wabbit has been spiking his cawwot jewice.... so, wabbit, do you ever have nightmares about being chased by Elmer Fudd with a shotgun?

bwtr · 6th May 2007, 06:47

I thought I was an "odd" one with these experiences but quite a few of my artistic friends report the same.

Maybee it's the Australian "WATER" we drink!!!???

crazy wabbit · 6th May 2007, 14:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate Owens

so, wabbit, do you ever have nightmares about being chased by Elmer Fudd with a shotgun?

Right now I carry my bow and arrow and will kill that son of a &^%$

Dann-O · 15th May 2007, 14:30

Art will always be subjective and time spent doing it has a bit to do with it too. I am strange I think Cartoons good ones are among the highest art forms out there. Many people think there is a lof of automation and the software does it all. With no vision with no effort there is no result.

5th May 2007, 04:40	#26 (permalink)
Nate Owens Doodlin' Dude Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: South Carolina, USA Posts: 1,013	Hmmm... don't think I ever did any black-light felt posters... and I don't think those figurines are plaster, but what do I know...? I just work for a living like all the other millions of writhing humanities... I'm sort of glad to be able to do something I like... I could be a pea-picker or a chicken plucker - and it's for sure that none of my anatomical parts are worth as much as Van's ear or wibble's dingus . I suspect it ("art") may fall into two camps... both of which are like the wind which can blow one direction and then the other. The times change but the mechanics are the same. 1: The art can appeal to the current "heartstrings" of the masses (at one time that may have been the Norman Rockwell fantasy of idyllic American Pie) which also changes like the wind. Or... 2: The art can be declared wonderful by those who, for a fleeting moment, have the ear and admiration of the people - yesteryear it was the pope who said Michelangelo could paint and then made him paint his ceiling - Mike hated it I think - ... or in more recent times, movie stars and authors of the moment who declared that Andy Warhol's tomato soup cans were awesome masterpieces. It may be sad but true that the mainstream doesn't have a clue (or a care) what art is, unless someone "important" tells them what to like. - - - sort of like that tale about the emperor's new clothes... My personal admiration and awe is for any (human) who can do what Michelangelo did with one piece of solid rock... totally mind-boggling - regardless of how many years it took. (sorry, cg artists) __________________ Shirts, MousePads, Stuff / The Gallery / Videos / Blog Last edited by Nate Owens; 5th May 2007 at 04:55.

5th May 2007, 04:50	#27 (permalink)
bwtr Brian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: South Australia Posts: 2,097	Sketchy! That is what I was saying. Art and beauty, in themselves, have no reason to connect. I can love a piece of work for it's Art, but hate it for it's "beauty"! It's a concept that is very hard to grasp at first but, when you can become an, well, "appreciator", it really does broaden the experiences of "visual gratifications" I suggest. A camera, a pencil, a brush,watercolour, oils,-------3D programmes-----all are only tools that are only a means to an end --not the end! We tend to carry on about the how when the really only important thing is the end result. As has been said in earlier threads, no one(other than our fellow crafstmen) really cares about the hard work and effort put into the end work. But the community will still give works one, two, three "star" ratings anyway! It was the story line!!!!!! Last edited by bwtr; 5th May 2007 at 05:03.

5th May 2007, 05:08	#28 (permalink)
Sketchy Box modeling Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 317	I'm not actually contradicting anybody here especially when I say "art is an individual thing." I call it art because you enjoyed doing it. For in the final analysis we can never please everybody. When I say that Picasso's art is crap doesn't mean it is not art. Perhaps I could have been more politically correct by saying I just don't appreciate it. Talk about time and place, Van Gogh's artworks were not appreciated during his time. His originals are now worth millions of dollars. (We should all pat ourselves in the back because we have a passion for this thing called 3d. We are among the luckiest people on earth. Most people can't stay at home for long. They feel restless. One friend gambled his way to bankruptcy. Another spends hundreds of dollars going out every weekend and goes home drunk.) Last edited by Sketchy; 5th May 2007 at 05:40.

6th May 2007, 05:53	#37 (permalink)
Nate Owens Doodlin' Dude Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: South Carolina, USA Posts: 1,013	Don't think I've had any of those episodes. Sounds like what mediums and spiritualists refer to as "spirit writing." There are times when I make an accidental "edit" to the art that I decide I like more than what I really intended. I have been known to compulsively doodle on napkins and paper placemats in restaurants... never had any complaints about doing it though. I think wabbit has been spiking his cawwot jewice.... so, wabbit, do you ever have nightmares about being chased by Elmer Fudd with a shotgun? __________________ Shirts, MousePads, Stuff / The Gallery / Videos / Blog

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5th May 2007, 03:17	#21 (permalink)
Sketchy Box modeling Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 317	Picasso's art is crap to me, but it is worth millions of dollars to others. There are people who can never draw/paint human heads, but are excellent in producing still-lifes or landscapes. They are still called artists. So what is art? Art, to me, is an individual thing. It's mainly to please oneself. It is art because you enjoyed doing it. The hell with the opinions of others. Fast forward we now have what we call WIPs or interactive critiques. Others' opinions are more important than ours. The individuality is lost. People are so obsessed into ultra realism. They talk about global illumination, ambient occlusion, radiosity, etc. You go to Blender's forum people are making a big deal out of this new SSS shading feature thinking that such feature will finally make their human model as realistic as humanly possible. It's as if humans actually look like candles. This has got to stop. This, I think, is what makes 3D users restless. They can't stick with one app.

5th May 2007, 03:31	#22 (permalink)
bwtr Brian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: South Australia Posts: 2,097	Beauty is in the eye of the beholder--and it's something that is "learned" by lifes experiences. ART is NOTHING to do with beauty. For those who study art and art history, the art in art is taking the learning of the past and adding to it. So saying a particular style of art is ,say. rubbish, is really a lack of understanding about the works creation, in time and place. Time and place. That is where, maybe, some 3D artists will, in retrospect, be added to a Hall Of Fame. There special works which greatly added to the contemporary sum of knowledge. Some of us are painters, some of us are craftsmen. Who of us will be amongst the few to be acknowledged as true "Artists"?

5th May 2007, 03:51	#25 (permalink)
Couerl Polygurbs Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Denver Posts: 1,307	Sketchy I agree with you that a lot of people are telling themselves, "If I only had this one more tool, I'll be good"... SSS and all that does not a better artist make, but rather they just add to what an artist can accomplish. I don't think I'll be one of those household names in 20 years by the way, I do 3D because I just like the idea of making things in 3 dimensions and actually like the modeling part more than anything else. I do welcome new tools anyway and I love to see what people do with them.

5th May 2007, 05:55	#29 (permalink)
bwtr Brian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: South Australia Posts: 2,097	Sketch, you said "I call it art because you enjoyed doing it" YES YES YES! But, would you, if you were not trying to better your effort with-- "the next one"? Who cares, really, if your work is not appreciated? All the fun is in the learning--the challenge--TO ONES SELF!

5th May 2007, 07:14	#31 (permalink)
bwtr Brian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: South Australia Posts: 2,097	Painting/Art?/3D--------SEX! Why do YOU do it?

5th May 2007, 18:29	#33 (permalink)
crazy wabbit Now, I learn animation Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 1,381	Call me crazy, but I truly believe that carrara does and can do most beautiful scenes. The ease of use and image quality are top notch. Carrara 6 and beyond will be even more amazing.

6th May 2007, 02:55	#35 (permalink)
bwtr Brian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: South Australia Posts: 2,097	I think most who are really into artistic pursuits occasionally have those episodes where the art takes hold of your mind and body and you get the fealing of being a second person, standing behind yourself, watching your hand being creative without your instruction. When you are finished, you look at the end result in amazement and wonder where that idea and effort originated. I know this is not an uncommon thing for artists--really a WOW!

6th May 2007, 06:47	#38 (permalink)
bwtr Brian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: South Australia Posts: 2,097	I thought I was an "odd" one with these experiences but quite a few of my artistic friends report the same. Maybee it's the Australian "WATER" we drink!!!???

15th May 2007, 14:30	#40 (permalink)
Dann-O AKA Monkey King Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Erie Pennsylvania Posts: 173	Art will always be subjective and time spent doing it has a bit to do with it too. I am strange I think Cartoons good ones are among the highest art forms out there. Many people think there is a lof of automation and the software does it all. With no vision with no effort there is no result.