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20th January 2006, 09:38
| #1 (permalink) |
| Vertex   Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 12
| Questions about Carrara
Hi, I'm considering buyign carrara to dabble in the 3d arts in my spare time and I was wondering what people think who have never touched a design program before? Also if anyone can break down the actual differenced between Basics, Carrara 5 and Carrara 5 Pro? Any help is appreciated as I don't really have access to classes or anything where I am I will be teaching myself from scratch.
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20th January 2006, 10:22
| #2 (permalink) |
| Securityman !   Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Turin
Posts: 142
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Hi DirectRevolt and welcome to this forum, I am also a newbie in 3D design and rendering and my work is not related to graphic/multimedia so I model and render in my spare time. Before to buy Carrara (one year ago) I have made a big software selection analizing software like Cinema4D, 3D Studio Max, Vue d'Esprit, Bryce and so on. At the end of 2 month of tests I have bought Carrara 4 Pro (now upgraded to 5 Pro) because is a quite complete rendering environment, is easy to use (is quite complex to reach photorealistic renderings but this is another story) and is also quite cheaper. The only thing (in my humble opinion) that in Carrara is difficult to learn is the modelling. For this reason I have bought Nevercenter Silo when Hexagon was not yet available (now I use Hexagon and I love it). Feel free to ask me more info if you need ... Regards
__________________ 2 x P4 2.8 Ghz, ATI9700, 1Gb of Ram, Win XP SP2 1 x Core Duo 1.66 Ghz, ATI X1400, 2Gb of Ram, Win XP SP2 |
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20th January 2006, 13:02
| #3 (permalink) |
| Now, I learn animation  Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,028
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DirectRevolt, I myslef looked at the demos for Hash Animation Master, True Space, Lightwave and even 3DS Max and Maya. Max and Maya were to expensive. I do have Maya PLE. I used Ray Dream Studio so I bought the Carrara 1.0 upgrade for $99.99 dollars. It was OK but not up to par with Hash AM and TS 4.3 for figure animation. Carrara 1.0 did not even have bones. I like the GUI of Carrara but I bought TS 4.3 also. I later bought TS 6.0 and Carrara 2.0. When Carrara 4 was realesed I bought it and soon sold my TS on ebay. I liked the Vertex modeler of Carrara better than the magic ring of TS 6 but TS 7 works a lot like Hexagon for modeling and so does Carrara's VM. The best thing to do is get the demo and try to watch the tutorials. Eovia does not have many tutorials on thier website like 3DS MAX, TS and Hash. I have heard rumor that Eovia should be adding a few more video tutorials. It should help put them on par against the competiton. Cinema 4 D is cool I liked the demo. I like Bryce and still use it once in a great while but Carrara can do anything Bryce can. I like Carrara but I think True Space 7 looks very good for the price. I have seen some good work with Hash's AM but to me the GUI was just to funky but you may like it best of all. I think Carrara, Hash AM, True Space and even Lightwave are priced decent and can all do some cool things but in the end you will find a GUI that works best for you. I think when Carrara 4 was released it was the best bang fort the buck but Lightwave has droped in price, AM has gotten better and so has TS. I never liked any of the free programs but some folks do. |
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20th January 2006, 15:35
| #4 (permalink) |
| Securityman ! Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Turin
Posts: 142
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I have just got my copy of TS 7 ... Arrrgggh!!!! Seems to be better in term of speed of the 6.6 release a lot of things are changed! I am not able to find something like File->New scene! I continue to prefer Carrara + Hexagon because for a newbie like me they are easy to use ... P.S. there is a free complete 3.2 version of TrueSpace that can be downloaded here: http://www.caligari.com/Products/tru...s/default.html (this can be a suggestion to Eovia guys ... why do not they release for free an older version of Carrara?  )
__________________ 2 x P4 2.8 Ghz, ATI9700, 1Gb of Ram, Win XP SP2 1 x Core Duo 1.66 Ghz, ATI X1400, 2Gb of Ram, Win XP SP2 |
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20th January 2006, 15:58
| #5 (permalink) |
| Now, I learn animation  Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,381
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Danilo, version 3.2 of truespace is no where near what version 3 of carrara is, I have both. If evoia was to realease version 3 of carrara then for $99.00 they could upgrade to c5 and that is never heard of. Too good to be true and the company would not make money at all.
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20th January 2006, 16:57
| #6 (permalink) |
| Securityman ! Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Turin
Posts: 142
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I was not talking about a specific Carrara version but of an old version (on the Digital Carvers Guild I have seen that some plugins are available for Carrara version 2.1 and 1.1 ... I am new to this software so I do not know the capabilities of the old Eovia software ...). On the other side Eovia can also do not permit the upgrade from this free version, as they have done for Amapi 6 that is downloadable from this forum... Other companies (E-on Software for example) have distributed a free version inside some magazines from which it was possible to upgrade to the upper version (NOT the newest version) to a price slightly discounted... From my point of view if Eovia will distribute an old version for free (adding a discount for the last supported old version) the only result can be to get some FEW new customers (hobbyst like me), the professionals will buy the last or the next to last version however because in the 3D field every new feature is usually necessary in order to get better results or to reduce the time in their workflow... other guys will continue to get warez (but I think that they will not use the software for anything than to increase the list of the "owned" titles). Sorry I think that this discussion is quite OT ...
__________________ 2 x P4 2.8 Ghz, ATI9700, 1Gb of Ram, Win XP SP2 1 x Core Duo 1.66 Ghz, ATI X1400, 2Gb of Ram, Win XP SP2 |
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20th January 2006, 21:38
| #7 (permalink) |
| Vertex  Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 27
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Hi and welcome to computer graphics! Here is a site with some affordable solutions and information. http://www.thebest3d.com/ The most important thing about software to me is the availability of tutorials. User guides are important, but tutorials tell what to do with the user guid open next to your computer! If I was just starting out again, I'd download a number of demos from the companies mentioned above - Lightwave, Cinema 4D. Probably 3DS Max and Maya are a little bit too much for a hobbiest in terms of cost and learning curve - but any good software will take time to learn from scratch - including Carrara. Cinema 4D is by far the easiest to learn for most people. I think you can get v. 3 of Carrara on several sites for around $50.00 (US) and then upgrade for a reasonable price if you like it. Carrara's rendering engine is the most bang for your buck - especially in v.5. For modeling I would consider the free program WINGS or the reasonably priced Silo or Carrara's partner, Hexagon. Carrara's modeler is still a bit quirky and limited - but the whole thing is worth it for the renderer alone. ----just my 2 cents worth---- good luck to you! wb |
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21st January 2006, 03:48
| #8 (permalink) |
| Vertex Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 12
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Don't mean to be a nag but I'm still trying to figure out the difference between Carrara Basics, Carrara 5 and Carrara 5 Pro... I'm pretty much set on Carrara because I used to use Ray Dream back in high school many many many moons ago and it was solid software then. I don't know much about modeling or shading or anything at this point but cost isn't to much of a worry, if I get Carrara 3 and upgrade can I only upgrade to a specific version of Carrara 5? or 5 Pro? I want to do some animations and whatnot with them. Also if I do end up purchasing it via the Eovia website should I get a physical shipment or a download??
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21st January 2006, 04:46
| #9 (permalink) |
| Box modeling Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 292
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In answer to your direct question of version differences... Carrara Basics has the same renderer as the other but it does have limits to some settings. Carrara Basic's biggest down-side (and it is really big) is the lack of the vertex modeler (VM). It does support the Spline Modeler (SM), which is good for mechanil objects. But the creations of characters is extremely awkward for that model. Everything has to be in parts like a robot. The VM has several tools are in itself are major components in 3D and since Basics doesn't have the VM you don't get any of these features: Morph Targets, UV Editor, and shading domains. If you want to seriously learn 3D then this is really not an option for you. Carrara 5 Standard is a good, low-priced solution to step into. There is improved modeling tools in the VM but not as many as in the Pro version. Most of what was in C4P moved over to C5S with the exception of certain built in plug-ins (TransPoser and CAD imports) and the ability to use multiple computers to render. You can do quite a lot with this version and it could serve you extremely well. Carrara 5 Professional has even more modeling tools in the VM, particularly dealing with spline controls. Don't worry about splines at the moment, it is just another means to model and create 3D objects. Carrara 5 Pro can support for up to 5 other computers to spread the rendering load onto. Pro also has a camera matching abilities (not likely something you'll get into for a good time, until you want Carrara to work in a production setting). Pro has just a couple of rendering enchancements to enhance speed for repetitive tasks (like saving GI/Ambient Occusion lighting info). The biggest points in my option is that if you plan on using Poser with Carrara, or want the ability to import CAD files, then this is supplied to you. The price difference between just adding this features to the Standard make the Pro version only a little more. Pro also has the latest and most improvements. Pro is also being more geared to animation abilities, so that is a concern to you. Ask away if you have any more questions, and do try out the demos. |
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21st January 2006, 05:20
| #11 (permalink) |
| Vertex Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 12
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Andrew, what is the difference between the vertex and the spline modeler? Should I invest in Hexagon as well? I'm not exactly sure what thats for? One of the users on the site is offering to sell me Carrara 3 and then I can upgrade to C5 Pro.. would I still need Hexagon? (If I do need it at all)
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21st January 2006, 08:56
| #12 (permalink) |
| Securityman ! Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Turin
Posts: 142
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The vertex modeler basically let you model by box, i.e. you can create basic primitives (9 types in Carrara: Sphere, Cube, Grid, Rectangle, Cylinder, Cone, Oval, Polyhedron and Polygon) and change the shape of it moving, adding, deleteting vertexes, edges and points in a few word you can create 3D objects "sculpting directly their surface". The spline modeler let you create 3D objects converting 2D shapes (usually curves) into 3D objects (model by spline). The standard tools inside this kind of modeler let you to extrude, lathe and sweep curves (a polyline can be also considered a "curve") in order to create objects. I have made a summary but the description of the modeling methods (box and spline) can fill many books! I have begun with the box modeling, because for me it was simpler, but I think that everyone has to begin as it seems him more natural/intuitive. To make a last example, from my point of view, it is simpler to model a washer with the technique of the boxes (vertex modeler), while it is being simpler to model a glass with the technique of the splines. Hexagon: when I have begun to model I have not felt to my ease with Carrara (I had already understood this using the demo), for which have purchased Silo. Today I use Hexagon and I find it more intuitive. My workflow consists in: Hexagon to model, Ultimate Unwrap 3D to prepare the particular textures (for example the labels on the bottles), Carrara 5 Pro for rendering everything. I hope that soon Eovia will improve the Hexagon tools for UV mapping so I can abandon Ultimate Unwrap 3D (in order to employ less time to realize my projects). In a few word from my point of view: 1 - if you can, buy Hexagon too and start to model with it 2 - (last but more important) download the demo versions and play with them! Have a good modelling (when you will start!)
__________________ 2 x P4 2.8 Ghz, ATI9700, 1Gb of Ram, Win XP SP2 1 x Core Duo 1.66 Ghz, ATI X1400, 2Gb of Ram, Win XP SP2 |
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21st January 2006, 10:18
| #13 (permalink) |
| Now, I learn animation Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,028
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Along with what others have said, I don't think Carrara Basic has bones and skeltons for figure animation. I don't think Carrara 5 standard has a graph editor like the Pro version. There may be other things we forgot. It is best to get the demos and watch the tutorials.
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21st January 2006, 11:51
| #14 (permalink) |
| NURBS Booleans are your friend Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Mansfield, Ohio, USA
Posts: 112
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Guys, if they were to make a version available for free, then they would need to make it as a NON upgradable version. For upgrade pricing, you would have to have a qualifying purchased version.
__________________ Carrara Newbie |
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21st January 2006, 16:22
| #15 (permalink) |
| Box modeling Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 292
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The vertex modeler is where you would practice box-modeling, point-by-point, and with C5P spline constrution. Box-modeling is taking a primative object like a cube and extruding faces and moving/rotating/scaling those faces to make the final object. Point-by-point is the creation of one polygon at a time to create a model. Spline contruction is taking (usually) several lines of connected vertexes and telling the program to connect them, for example think of builing a row of segments in the form of a rib-cage. The rig-cage when each row is connected will form a smooth, curved surface around it. It is important to note that at all times in the VM you are directly in control of how the surface of a model is built. The Spline Modeler is the taking of a 2D, vector shape and projecting that along another 2D curve. (actually you can project the 2D along a 3D, but that's a more complicated task). As long as the object is either similar through-out or grows in one direction, you'll be able to model it. For example, a lamp post is easily done, however an arm With a hand is not. Organic modeling is very differcult to model within the spline modeler and it is by far faster to do this in the VM. Hexagon is a polygon modeling. Similar to what you can do in the VM but far better. It has tons of tools to make this task faster and easilier. A program like this is called a dedicated modeler. I personally use Hexagon and Wings3D to model with. I use the VM to apply shading domains and morph targets, but usually do not use the modeling tools within it. If you are just starting off and want to be serious about 3D, then consider C5P. Consider Hexagon later if you want to delve into modeling more. |
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21st January 2006, 19:53
| #16 (permalink) |
| Vertex Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 12
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Ok, wheres a couple questions for you... I was dabbling with the demo and I remember the gist of how to use the spline modeler so I was playing around with it trying to make a sword blade. Now, If I'm not mistaken in order to create the tip to the sword blade I need to create a section near the end and then drop all the points to the tip there by not collapsing the entire blade and only a small portion by the end. However I can't seem to do this properly or find a modeler tutorial to help remind me what I'm doing wrong. I'm going to try to include a bmp of what I'm looking at.
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21st January 2006, 22:52
| #17 (permalink) |
| Vertex Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 12
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And one more question... sorry to bug you guys so much. I here people talking about Carrara 6 a lot... When is C6 supposed to be coming out?? I don't want to spend a boatload just to buy C3S upgrade to C5Pro and then have to upgrade to C6Pro.
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23rd January 2006, 12:33
| #19 (permalink) |
| NURBS Booleans are your friend Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Mansfield, Ohio, USA
Posts: 112
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I would not worry. C5 just came out at the end of December. Going from CS3 to C5Pro will cost you less than CS3 to C4Pro, then C4Pro to C5 Pro (which I did).
__________________ Carrara Newbie |
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