No Reference Guide available with package any more!!! - Polyloop

Bertmg · 17th January 2006, 23:20

I just recieved my package with C5Pro sent by mail and I was extremely dissapoined to find out that the "Reference Guide" printed book does not come included in the package any longer. Instead there is a piece of paper telling me that I can purchase it at the Eovia store for aditionally $25.oo ( plus s/h).

What gives? my C4 pro upgrade has it and so do most software one buys from any vendor. This book is an excelent reference guide and learning tool for us beginers and I bet profesionals as well. Unless Eovia will be posting it for free in their site, this is not cool at all.

I really feel betrayed by one of my favorite companies!

Patrick210 · 17th January 2006, 23:43

It is also in PDF form on the disc. They lowered the price so that you get Carrara for less and then have the option to purchase the manual. I think it is a good idea. It gives people 3 options, cheapest - download+PDF manual , next price - boxed CDs + PDF manual, highest price option - boxed CDs + paper manual. I think the only problem was in the marketing message. It wasn't clear enough that you have actually 3 options and are really getting a discount if you take the less expensive option.
I wouldn't feel betrayed, I think that even with paying extra for the manual, that C5Pro is less expensive than C4Pro was. Many companies are going with the PDF manual now, too.

Patrick

jval · 17th January 2006, 23:43

Right from the beginning Eovia told us that a printed manual would not be included. Instead, one would be available some time after C5's release and for an additional charge of twenty or so odd dollars.

Many users don't really care about having a printed manual. If it was included C5 would probably have cost a bit more so these users would be paying for something they didn't want. By making the printed manual an optional extra only those who want it will need pay for it. That seems fairer to me even though I'll probably be buying one.

I doubt that Eovia will be making it available as a download from their site as a pdf version is already included with the software.

- Jack

Bertmg · 18th January 2006, 00:33

Because some of you may be experienced artists who may be able to use Carrara with their eyes close and hardly use the Reference Guide, you may be hard to convince. But for us mere mortals, who are beginers or pros who like to reffer to a book on hand while working on an application, it is quite dissapointing.

I am a QA software enginner and unfortunatelly most software companies have forgotten this concept. This is the part of the product's usability feature which provides customer satisfaction. Have anyone heard the story abou the "extra picle in the burger"?

I apologize, because I was so upset I started this thread while there was one already in progress. Please follow

Eovia3D.net > English > Eovia & Eovia3D.net "Where is the Manual"

jval · 18th January 2006, 01:43

I do not wish to belittle the disappointment of those who expected a printed manual with the boxed versions of Carrara 5. I suspect Eovia could have avoided such feelings if they had included the printed manual but increased the price by $30 instead- even though this would amount to the same thing as the status quo.

Maybe they'll do that for Carrara 6. Of course, then some will complain about paying for a paper book they don't want. Damned if you do and damned if you dont... (You can't keep everyone happy. That's why I only have one wife. grin)

Oh well. At least a printed manual *will* be available for those who want one.

- Jack

Marathon · 18th January 2006, 02:32

I'm always a bit disappointed when a product comes without a manual, also. I like to have "the book" in front of me while I'm working on something, rather than having to tab back and forth between the application and a PDF.

However, it IS nice that they're still offering one, even if it doesn't ship with the application by default. I purchased the downloadable version, and being a long time Carrara user, no longer miss having the manual. The occasional look-up in the PDF is fine in my case.

But if I were just starting? You bet I'd want that manual.

andywright · 19th January 2006, 12:56

Well I am a beginner to 3D but a long time computer user. I used to like when manuals came with the product, but as said earlier in the thread, most of the software I buy now comes with PDF manuals (when was the last time you saw a proper manual with Microsoft operating systems...mine was MSDOS 5 !)

For now I have printed my manual off at 4 pages to a side double sided, only 100 pages of paper, readable and bound in a flip folder total cost about £4 including ink

Not as pretty as a book but useable and cheap

steama · 19th January 2006, 18:27

This is a worn out issues covered extensively in other posts. I for one am happy with the additional cost savings from the use of a pdf manual instead and prefer to have it as a choice as an addition for the hard copy manual. If you want the manual then you can buy one from Eovia. Many of us are happy with the FREE pdf manual. It was also stated that a printed manual was not included with the box version of C5.

The cost of your application was LESS because the printed manual was not automatically included. Use those saving and buy a printed manual if you wish.

Good Luck

steama · 19th January 2006, 18:34

I know that because Eovia made the printed manual as an option saved me money on my C5Pro purchase. I am vey thankful and happy about that. The PDF manual is fine for me. Heck if I want a printed manual I can purchase one with the savings I had from the upgrade costs.

17th January 2006, 23:20	#1 (permalink)
Bertmg Spline Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: San Diego Posts: 38	No Reference Guide available with package any more!!! I just recieved my package with C5Pro sent by mail and I was extremely dissapoined to find out that the "Reference Guide" printed book does not come included in the package any longer. Instead there is a piece of paper telling me that I can purchase it at the Eovia store for aditionally $25.oo ( plus s/h). What gives? my C4 pro upgrade has it and so do most software one buys from any vendor. This book is an excelent reference guide and learning tool for us beginers and I bet profesionals as well. Unless Eovia will be posting it for free in their site, this is not cool at all. I really feel betrayed by one of my favorite companies!

18th January 2006, 00:33	#4 (permalink)
Bertmg Spline Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: San Diego Posts: 38	Sorry for my venting, there was another thread in place Because some of you may be experienced artists who may be able to use Carrara with their eyes close and hardly use the Reference Guide, you may be hard to convince. But for us mere mortals, who are beginers or pros who like to reffer to a book on hand while working on an application, it is quite dissapointing. I am a QA software enginner and unfortunatelly most software companies have forgotten this concept. This is the part of the product's usability feature which provides customer satisfaction. Have anyone heard the story abou the "extra picle in the burger"? I apologize, because I was so upset I started this thread while there was one already in progress. Please follow Eovia3D.net > English > Eovia & Eovia3D.net "Where is the Manual"

19th January 2006, 12:56	#7 (permalink)
andywright Extrusion Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Oxfordshire, UK Posts: 154	Well I am a beginner to 3D but a long time computer user. I used to like when manuals came with the product, but as said earlier in the thread, most of the software I buy now comes with PDF manuals (when was the last time you saw a proper manual with Microsoft operating systems...mine was MSDOS 5 !) For now I have printed my manual off at 4 pages to a side double sided, only 100 pages of paper, readable and bound in a flip folder total cost about £4 including ink Not as pretty as a book but useable and cheap __________________ Athlon 64 X2 4400+ Win XP Pro, 2 GB DDR 400 MHz Geoforce 6800GT Xtreme 256 MB. Carrara 5 Pro, Hexagon 2.01, Lightwave 8.5 Poser 6, DAZ Studio, Vu 5 Infinite, Bryce 5.5 www.wright-site.co.uk

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17th January 2006, 23:43	#2 (permalink)
Patrick210 Pixar want to hire me! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 549	It is also in PDF form on the disc. They lowered the price so that you get Carrara for less and then have the option to purchase the manual. I think it is a good idea. It gives people 3 options, cheapest - download+PDF manual , next price - boxed CDs + PDF manual, highest price option - boxed CDs + paper manual. I think the only problem was in the marketing message. It wasn't clear enough that you have actually 3 options and are really getting a discount if you take the less expensive option. I wouldn't feel betrayed, I think that even with paying extra for the manual, that C5Pro is less expensive than C4Pro was. Many companies are going with the PDF manual now, too. Patrick

17th January 2006, 23:43	#3 (permalink)
jval Cube Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 87	Right from the beginning Eovia told us that a printed manual would not be included. Instead, one would be available some time after C5's release and for an additional charge of twenty or so odd dollars. Many users don't really care about having a printed manual. If it was included C5 would probably have cost a bit more so these users would be paying for something they didn't want. By making the printed manual an optional extra only those who want it will need pay for it. That seems fairer to me even though I'll probably be buying one. I doubt that Eovia will be making it available as a download from their site as a pdf version is already included with the software. - Jack

18th January 2006, 01:43	#5 (permalink)
jval Cube Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 87	I do not wish to belittle the disappointment of those who expected a printed manual with the boxed versions of Carrara 5. I suspect Eovia could have avoided such feelings if they had included the printed manual but increased the price by $30 instead- even though this would amount to the same thing as the status quo. Maybe they'll do that for Carrara 6. Of course, then some will complain about paying for a paper book they don't want. Damned if you do and damned if you dont... (You can't keep everyone happy. That's why I only have one wife. grin) Oh well. At least a printed manual will be available for those who want one. - Jack

18th January 2006, 02:32	#6 (permalink)
Marathon Spline Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 52	I'm always a bit disappointed when a product comes without a manual, also. I like to have "the book" in front of me while I'm working on something, rather than having to tab back and forth between the application and a PDF. However, it IS nice that they're still offering one, even if it doesn't ship with the application by default. I purchased the downloadable version, and being a long time Carrara user, no longer miss having the manual. The occasional look-up in the PDF is fine in my case. But if I were just starting? You bet I'd want that manual.

19th January 2006, 18:27	#8 (permalink)
steama Boulet Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 452	This is a worn out issues covered extensively in other posts. I for one am happy with the additional cost savings from the use of a pdf manual instead and prefer to have it as a choice as an addition for the hard copy manual. If you want the manual then you can buy one from Eovia. Many of us are happy with the FREE pdf manual. It was also stated that a printed manual was not included with the box version of C5. The cost of your application was LESS because the printed manual was not automatically included. Use those saving and buy a printed manual if you wish. Good Luck

19th January 2006, 18:34	#9 (permalink)
steama Boulet Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 452	I know that because Eovia made the printed manual as an option saved me money on my C5Pro purchase. I am vey thankful and happy about that. The PDF manual is fine for me. Heck if I want a printed manual I can purchase one with the savings I had from the upgrade costs.